I Before E, Except After C Rule Left to D-I-E

1. LAN3
   June 20th, 2009 at 3:45 pm

   The rule I've found more useful is "When two vowels go walking, the second one does the talking." By and large, the second of two consecutive vowels contributes its sound more than the first.

2. Sammy
   June 20th, 2009 at 6:21 pm

   I always thought the rhyme went on to something like "except as in 'a' like in neighbor and weigh"

3. Grammar Nazi
   June 20th, 2009 at 6:21 pm

   Stupid joke is stupid

4. Johnny Cat
   June 20th, 2009 at 6:22 pm

   I gave up on silly rhyming schemes to learn correct spelling a long time ago, due to this ie/C thing. I decided to just learn the words themselves, and that worked feni...er, fine.

5. FelixNeatorama
   June 20th, 2009 at 6:52 pm

   Running some numbers on a 60,000 word dictionary with word-counts for each word (in millions) (e.g.

   Counts for words you'd goof if you use the i-before-e... rule:

   Counts for words with cie: 146

   Counts for words with not C ei: 394

   Counts for words you'd get correct:

   Words with cei: 73

   Not c ie: 1,836

   These numbers change if you know to never begin a word with ie nor end a word with eis. (Exceptions to this are very, very rare.)

   The words "their" and "being" count for 154, so if you remember them, you're in pretty good shape with the rule. Right: 2063. Wrong: 386.

6. ericrod
   June 20th, 2009 at 6:57 pm

   Or, the could just teach them the whole poem, which is always useful when spelling those tricky words: i before e except after c OR WHEN SOUNDING AN A AS IN NEIGHBOR OR WEIGH.

7. ::mwah::
   June 20th, 2009 at 7:04 pm

   i before e except after c
   we live in a weird society

8. Jacinda
   June 21st, 2009 at 1:25 am

   Sammy - I think you learnt the one I did -

   i before e except after c, or when said like 'a' such as neighbour and weigh.

   Alas the rule never explained the exception for weird xD

   The rule might not be entirely correct, but it's still a good basis to teach primary school kids in my opinion. The amount of atrocious spelling I see from my 20-something friends is more than enough proof of that in my opinion.

9. Camelot
   June 21st, 2009 at 1:53 am

   I learned the rhyme a little different:

   I before I, when sounded as 'e', except after 'c'

   It's worked well for me over the years since I went to school

10. bud
    June 21st, 2009 at 2:12 am

    I would never even consider the rule for words like veil or sufficient; I think the "words with ee sound" is understood. And it still helps for those words that it DOES work for.

    But if you are going to misuse the rule for veil and sufficient, you are probably going to have some issues with spelling anyway.

11. Doug
    June 21st, 2009 at 7:57 am

    bud:
    You say the rule helps for the word that it works for, but that precludes that everyone knows what words it works for and what words it doesn't. What's the point of having the rule if we all have to memorize what words are applicable?

12. GailW
    June 21st, 2009 at 10:38 am

    Retarded

13. D Bozko
    June 21st, 2009 at 11:06 am

    English is a very difficult language. Receive vs weigh vs weird. It seems that every rule has an exception. That's why I always have a dictionary handy.

14. andiscandis
    June 21st, 2009 at 6:14 pm

    Weird.

15. superman
    June 22nd, 2009 at 6:04 am

    It's a general rule for introductory words rooted in the English language that serves as the first rung. Eventually it sinks in that there are other words that don't follow the song– most other words; but it's just a song. You don't take away a childhood, educational song about colors because it doesn't cover all of the colors either. This is impudent and uncool. As a mostly british gentleman, I want you to know that I don't support this in the least bit. It's not like I go to spell a word that I know doesn't follow the rule, and then think to myself– "Yeah...but the song said that it was–".

    This is just plain silly. There's a reason this story is being posted in the 'Oddly Enough' sections of the world, and it's because you have to ask "What do they care?" Ban a miniature children's rhyme.

16. RSMilward
    June 22nd, 2009 at 7:33 am

    Seize the weird ancient Raleigh scientist being.
    So their...I mean, there!
    There are many others, but jeez, add this to the recent move to drop apostrophes, and you're really increasing the chances of being misunderstood.

17. David Simpson
    June 22nd, 2009 at 8:53 am

    The FULL rule, as I learnt it, is:

    "'i' before 'e' except after 'c' when it rhymes with 'me'."

    I have yet to find any exception to this rule. The reason for the failure is the problem that many people did not learn the full version of the rule and many teachers were ignorant of the full version.

    I was taught the full rule by my Mother who was a licensed Teacher with many years experience and I myself am a Trained Primary School teacher.

    When I was in the Fourth Grade of my primary school I pointed out the full rule to the teacher who had never heard it before. She then tried to list may of te words that did not follow the shortened rule and became very upset, and almost abusive, when I pointed out that none of her extensive list rhymed with 'me'.

18. hazelshade
    June 22nd, 2009 at 10:45 am

    Lan3-- “When two vowels go walking, the second one does the talking” may not be a perfect rule for English words, this is a great rule for remembering how to pronounce German words (especially German last names) which often have "ie" or "ei" and which always seem to cause confusion!

19. pakopako
    June 22nd, 2009 at 3:27 pm

    Ah, I can see the headlines now:
    "Limey guv to kids: Lern English good"

20. zeno
    June 23rd, 2009 at 12:32 am

    While I enjoy that Brits spell "color" as "colour" (and the spell checker on this site doesn't like "colour") it's understandable that they have problems spelling. Consider these words: learnt for learned, burnt for burned, towards for toward. Most people these days have difficulty spelling or speaking. People use words that don't even exist such as lent for loaned.

21. David Simpson
    June 23rd, 2009 at 1:36 am

    "Lent" is indeed a word. It is the past participle of "lend".

    Definition
    lent (LEND)
    past simple and past participle of lend

    eg I lent her my handkerchief.

    Learnt is the past simple and past participle of learn.

    eg He learnt his lesson.

    "Learned" is defined thus:
    learned
    adjective FORMAL
    describes someone who has studied for a long time and has a lot of knowledge:

    eg a learned professor

    From Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary.

    The other words you cited fall into the same category. Americans attempt to distort the language but for reference you should always consult an English, English dictionary if you are going to complain about the use of allegedly, non-existent words. Especially as this topic is about the English not the Americans.

22. Wayne
    August 6th, 2009 at 9:13 am

    “‘i’ before ‘e’ except after ‘c’ when it rhymes with ‘me’.”

    I like it!

    Pass it on!

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