The argument of Mac vs PC (or more accurately, Mac vs Windows) is as old as time itself - that is, if time started in 1984, the year that the Mac was introduced.
Sure Windows is bad. Awfully bad (I'm looking at you, Vista) but according to Charlie Brooker of The Guardian, there is something worse than Microsoft's operating system: the cult of Mac worshippers!
Consequently, nothing pleases them more than watching a PC owner struggle with a slab of non-Mac machinery. It validates their spiritual choice. Recently I sat in a room trying to write something on a Sony Vaio PC laptop which seemed to be running a special slow-motion edition of Windows Vista specifically designed to infuriate human beings as much as possible. Trying to get it to do anything was like issuing instructions to a depressed employee over a sluggish satellite feed. When I clicked on an application it spent a small eternity contemplating the philosophical implications of opening it, begrudgingly complying with my request several months later. It drove me up the wall. I called it a bastard and worse. At one point I punched a table.
This drew the attention of two nearby Mac owners. They hovered over and stood beside me, like placid monks.
"Ah: the delights of Vista," said one.
"It really is time you got a Mac," said the other.
"They're just better," sang monk number one.
"You won't regret it," whispered the second.
But never fear, dear Mac lovers, Microsoft is trying to brew its own cult by using Windows 7 Launch Parties propaganda: Link
At they end of the day, an operating system is just an operating system, it's all down to personal preference and anyone who gets that obsessive about which they use needs to find a new hobby.
An OS (and computer, or phone, or mp3 player) is a tool, not a lifestyle choice.
My PC is running Ubuntu. It rarely freezes, never crashes, is speedy and cooperative. The OS is easy to navigate, a lovely blend of intuitive and practical.
The linux community is cooperative and largely without attitude.
And the OS is free. Yep....free. Sharing, go figure! :)
the price for beeing a mac-user seems so be becoming a smug a-hole who is just incompatible with ppl as the mac he uses
Good afternoon laugh though. Thanks!
There's nothing more idiotic than saying..."I don't care how great something apparently is, I hate it because I want to hate it. I'm a writer, and my tools are computers, but I'm going to stamp my feet and pout because some people love their machines!"
Did he ever think that some people are evangelizing these things because they've found the solution to EXACTLY what he was complaining about...computer problems like unexplained slow downs? That they've dealt with printer driver errors, slow boot ups, viruses, and just general odd behavior for years before finding out it doesn't have to be that way? It's not a cult or a religion, it's just people finding something that works a whole lot better for them and has released them from a lot of frustration.
(And I speak from experience...I used a PC every day for 10 years before giving Macs a try and right now bounce between both happily. I will say that the Mac Pro that I own, and run both OSs on, is the finest built computer...Mac or PC...that I have ever owned. It's quiet, astoundingly stable, and powerful. I cannot say that about the many PCs I've owned and built.)
I'm guessing that software and any OS has its inherent anger-inducing frustrations, and that an average non-linnux-brained user has to go through a process of learning how to cope with shortcomings, to the point of embracing their chosen OS.
Example:
1. You learn at some point early on that that tiny square with the X in it in the top right corner of the screen closes your program. Why? Because they told you so. A little annoyed? Yes, but now I know, and thank goodness I don't have to go through that again.
2. You open an application on the Mac, and when someone tells you to click the red button on the top left instead of the box with the X in the top right, it seems "wrong." When you do so, and the application hasn't quit (just the window has closed), cue annoyance.
Live and let live...
I mean, he's entitled to his opinion and his OS choice, as is everyone else, but are we sure Mr. Brooker is the best source for a balanced view on this particular topic?
I mean, there are Mac "fanboys" (I hate that word) and Windows "fanboys" and Linux "fanboys", and I wouldn't ask any one of them for a balanced comparison of the various OS options and their proponents, because they usually offer more contempt than facts. And this Brooker character, I'm pretty sure, falls into the Windows fanboys camp.
These Linksys people are just out of control.
Isn’t Charlie Brooker known as the Guardian’s most die-hard anti-mac columnists, famous for being determined to badmouth the OS and its users with utter disregard for any actual information for or against?
Er, no. I've been reading his column for years and he's never even mentioned them before.
1) The Mac vs. PC commercials: they stopped being novel and funny YEARS ago. Apple uses the tactic of belittling and insulting the intelligence of the very people that they are trying to get to switch over. They portray PCs (and therefore the people that use them) in a very negative light, often stretching the truth or outright lying. I don't respond well to negative advertising and really would like to confine that shit to every fours years during the election.
2) I like to customize my computer. I saved a good $1K on the most recent rig I built, were I to purchase it from a vendor. If it were a Mac, I'd pay about another $2K and the specs wouldn't be nearly as good. Oh, and it has run flawlessly since day one using Win 7 RC.
3) If my iPod and the crappy iTunes software are any sort of indication of what I'd be getting with a switch to Apple-- no thanks.
Geeze.. :\
A) Attack anyone who dared to include such article. "This is the worst thing I've read in this site."
B) Defame the author of the original article. "The person who wrote the article is a Windows fanboy."
C) Undermine enemies' choice. "Vista sucks."
It is not just Apple. The product cult phenomenon appears in any genres that has an expensive variation that does the exact same thing, for example:
- Music: People who insist on playing their eclectic songs on your stereo when they come visit.
- Cars: Mercedes Benz, BMW drivers. They usually say nothing when they encounter a Rolls Royce.
- Audio equipment: Those who have gigantic speakers, but only knows to play the worst pop or hiphop music.
- Art: Just go inside a snobbish rich man's house showing their million-dollar painting. Thankfully, modern art is here to dissolve this whole complex, since modern art can be 'done' by 3-year-olds.
Most of my people I know who use a Mac from their parents are not snobs. They usually don't care, and are not aware of the cult. Their desktops are usually filled with icons, and the only tool they use is Safari. The computers are usually filled with dents and scratches that will make a Mac-lover cry.
Those who buy a Mac themselves are snobs. Why? They need to prove themselves for all the losses of money for purchasing from Apple. They need reasons to justify such cost. One way to justify is to tell others that alternatives suck, i.e. snobs.
It is easy to tell who the snobs are. Usually, their computers are pristine, their desktop screens are super tidy, and you will also spot the white Apple stickers on other objects in their homes.
But I do find Mac fanatics to be unbearable types. Almost snooty.
But hey, if they want to by a low powered system for almost twice the cost, that's their business.
It's so ridiculous when everyone is arguing their opinion and they expect to just change people's minds instantly.
I used Windows XP for as long as I was on a computer. I think it's a perfectly fine OS.
I ended up getting a black Macbook 2.5 years ago, and I'm definitely glad with the purchase, but I dual-boot XP on it anyways so that I can get the benefits from both OS's.
I hate being included in the group of the "Apple cult". Yeah, I own a Macbook and iPhone, but I'm no spaz. They are absolutely, hands down, some of the most annoying people on the internets. Some Windows-defenders, however, can be just as annoying to listen to too, and I'm really glad that there aren't so many Linux-fanatics because then we would all probably just shoot ourselves.
Sure, the Mac-Tax is absurd, because yes, you are paying mostly for the OS, but the OS is clean and easy to use.
I'm just hoping that with Windows 7 out, people will just shutup and come to some sort of agreement, because Win 7 is a pretty sweet OS. I'm pretty excited to build a dual-boot Win7/Ubuntu desktop and have all the options available to me.
Pros - OS written/updated specifically for the hardware, fewer hardware/software issues, far fewer virus/spyware/adware/___ware issues.
Cons - Expensive, run the risk of being a snob
Windows
Pros - Most widely used, tons of different options for purchasing your computer, the ability to always use the newest/fastest hardware, also the option of having a computer on the cheap.
Cons - Most widely used so nearly all viruses are written for it, have had to deal with a few bad OS's (Windows ME, 2000, Vista).
Linux
Pros - Everything is free, super customizable, no viruses, Wine let's you run pretty much any Window's program, everything's free
Cons - Kindof tough to transition to (tons of guides out there though), using Terminal can be pretty intense
i feel that all of the zealous behaviour boils down to advertising and design. i'm suprised nobody ever realizes this.
they are computers and nothing more. it's the image that is projected that effects the way people feel about them.
windows has a lot going for them, but i am constantly amazed at how moronic their advertising and branding department is. they need to literally all be fired.
probably their design department too, but bringing in better designers and advertising would cost more money and then they wouldn't be so cheap.
anyways, mac commercials are enchanting (i'm not being subjective here, it's a witnessed fact, people believe what they say) mac design is impeccable. the designers behind the look of mac products have effected web design, film aethetics, and of course the design of other high tech gadgets.
windows computers look bad. people have eyes and cannot help but develop a bias based on appearence.
those windows ads are the pits though, the whole "windows mohave" campaign was patronizing and convoluted. the people they talked to were offputting and the music they played was lame.
windows needs a makeover like the one mac got when the first gen imacs came out. it would be simple and smart. all matte black computers and a hard business slogan like "you're an adult now, buy a pc" or "you have work to do, do it on a pc" or "go pro, go pc"
windows mohave?? a non-existant bait and switch ad campaign centered around the idea that people think their os is terrible? this is amateur advertising. people say the product is bad? say it's the best thing ever. people say it's hard to use? say it's meant for smart people.
geeeze i'm a 21 year old kid and these things are obvious to me.
I say that neither one is perfect. And neither one is spiritually fulfilling. Not even a little bit.
As long as I have a computer that will allow me to type my essays for school, I'm happy as a clam. I don't need to spend the extra pennies for a prettier computer. Sorry, Apple.
"they need to literally all be fired."
A literal firing as opposed to a figurative one? Good to know.
"anyways, mac commercials are enchanting"
I find Mac commercials ANYTHING but enchanting. In fact, you've lost all credibility by saying that. Where is your proof that people are enchanted by their ads? The only one I find is a curse that makes me roll me eyes when I see them. Anyway, by saying that, you've exposed yourself as a fanboy the likes of which would be first in line to fill the position of Job's love slave - where you pay him for the "privilege".
"windows computers look bad"
Care to qualify that statement? My PC looks pretty damn sweet. I would stick needles in my eyes before looking at an iFroot.
"people say the product is bad? say it’s the best thing ever"
But... that's what apple does!
mac commercials are enchanting, i'm gonna stick by that, of course this doesn't apply to everybody...almost nothing does. (does not apply to you apparently) lots of people are enchanted though, young kids, lots of moms, people who don't know anything about computers. once you know something about computers there are different issues to be weighed...but for the large number of people who have no clue what goes into computers they see mac ads and buy the marketing ploy.
do you realize that you literally took my message personally? literally.
I now prefer Apple, but if I had to I could switch to Windows. So I don't really count myself as member of the "Cult of Mac".
"Yes, the fact that you recompiled your kernel to add the driver for that device is impressive... In fact my Grandma is trying to get one of those things working right now. Would you mind telling her how to do it?"
C-64 forevaaaaaa!
(ok... maybe just when I want to listen to Sids or play some oldschool games.)
"It's grim, it's slow, everything's badly designed and nothing really works properly: using Windows is like living in a communist bloc nation circa 1981. And I wouldn't change it for the world, because I'm an abject bloody idiot and I hate myself, and this is what I deserve: to be sentenced to Windows for life."
See? We can all join hands and agree! Windows is hellish and broken, but for most of the world, that's just fine!
I enjoy the Mac commercials, by the way, for a reason Microsoft's never figured out (as is painfully shown by their misfired ad attempts): the PC guy is the LIKEABLE one. You FEEL for the PC guy. You so want to help him out by getting him a Mac, so he can supplant that damn Mac guy and shove his slacker-cool ass off the pristine screen.
So far, I have been using OSX (which, after all, now works on some PCs), Windows and Linux, with preference always going towards Windows and Linux as dualboot.
OSX is pretty initially, but depending on how you want to use your system it soon becomes quite annoying - oh and i have seen OSX crashing regularly. Also, in huge network environments they don't tend to work very well if you are unwilling to spend a lot of cash on Apple Servers.
Windows got a lot better. Microsoft got a lot better. Look at the free support knowledge DB coming straight from the company rather than only fellow users - and their tipps do include more technical stuff like changes to the registry etc. Look at the support they're giving out for junior developers (or wannabe-developers). And ever since I've started working in videogames, I have learned to appreciate Microsoft more and more.
My main OS on my laptop is Vista - after I got rid of the admittedly utterly slow 32 bit version it's now on 64bit and runs like a charm. No crashes so far (knocking on wood) and it's at over one year by now. This is where most everyday stuff gets done easily with a lot of clicking and surprisingly little need for maintenance.
Backup system is Debian Linux, which is good for keeping your brain active as there's always something to fix when you run experimental (which ... you know the risk of when installing). It's also good for system, network analysis and other stuff.
What is most annoying about apple is their habit of overpricing things just because they have rounded corners and are white or silver. Or black, sometimes. I mean ... really?
However, I will get an iPhone. Currently the iphone store seems a bit better than android ...
Btw. I'm so totes a Mac guy. Lol. You PC users are such epic fails. Win. Pwn.
all the windows fanboys in this thread are way more annoying than the mac fanboys. i don't think anybody in this discussion has actually said anything disparaging about windows users and the windows users have often berated mac users as bad or stupid or lame people. that's kind of pathetic guys. see poneyup's post for an example of really unnecessary mocking.
Charlie remains the funniest columnist around and it's very, very sad that there are people who, on reading that piece, think only to put finger to keyboard in order to perpetuate the whole pointless Mac v. Windows debate. Ah but what about Linux? Linux? Linux! It isn't as good as FreeBSD. You're all forgetting BeOS. etc. etc. etc. ad infinitum. The ennui is mind blowing.
To paraphrase Bill Shatner; For christ's sake people, they're only computers!
How about, if you're having such horrible issues with a PC, then you're not doing it right. And stop clicking on banner ads, geez.
I'm not sure why people are complaining that they have to throw out their macs after a few years. I had one that was ten years old that ran everything I needed just fine until a couple of years ago when I started wanting to play PC games via boot camp, at which point I dropped $1200 on a used Intel Mac (G5 tower). I have been very happy with it, and it does everything I want, including playing the most graphics intensive PC games (and even the old stuff that I missed from my Windows days, like Alpha Centauri--since I can have multiple versions of Windows).
My Dad is still struggling with PC issues, and has been for years. After seeing how easy it is, ad how you can get a nice computer for not too much used, and seeing how long they last, and how they aren't so vulnerable to system decay as Windows is, he's finally been convinced, and has said that his next computer will be a Mac.
I have bought one new Apple computer in my life, a Mac mini, which didn't do the job I wanted it for, but has been repurposed as a media center with great results. If you want a great computer for cheap, don't get the Mini, instead go for a used Mac, especially within a month or two of the release of a new generation of hardware. You can get a great deal on a top of the line last generation computer that will last you for 5-8 years easily, and perhaps longer, if you don't want to play new games ;).
On an unrelated note I'm pretty sure this comment wont show up because of the CUSSSSSSSinNG
Years ago, they were arguing the crisp greyscale monitor was superior to any color monitor, until the mac II's brought color. They argued appletalk beat ethernet or netbios or tcp/ip, until Apple ditched appletalk. Or 68k/PowerPC was vastly better than intel family procs (often accompanied by arguments over the superiorness of big-endianess), or pre-emptive multitasking is a waste of time and resources. Unix, including NeXTStep, was widely despised by 90s mac users.
And then, every time Apple moves to some already-established standard, it's hailed as revolutionary in the press, and everyone seems to change their opinion to love what they previously hated.
People talking about superior Apple design are missing the point: PCs have all kinds of looks depending on who puts them together, but the basic design is a case that allows a number of different components to be installed. Macs are a preselected package (except for some of the higher end machines). I've built PCs with windows in the sides and lights and bells and whistles. The one I have now is a sleek black box, The case design is optimized for airflow and cooling.
Apple OS X, Vista, Win 7, Ubuntu, whatever turns your crank is the one to use. (I do like some of the features of Snow Leopard, but the first OS X was a dog of a system.)
its all marketing.
Of course you might say what MS did was take some of the best Mac features and copy them onto Win 7 (some of my favorites: task bar buttons that either open current windows and only if there aren't any then open a new copy of the application--visualization of windows from the taskbar [reminiscent of expose], widg-er-gadgets, nice looking visual effects, etc). Anyway, it's pretty darned good, I think. Still have to think more about viruses (don't start telling me "that's because windows has more market share..." because how does that change the fact that I still have to deal with them? I don't care WHY it has viruses or that the Mac COULD have viruses, I care that windows DOES have viruses and the Mac, for the most part DOES NOT).
One of the biggest is Finder. It speaks volumes that there are commercial alternatives out there that do what Finder doesn't. I was mortified not to find the option to 'cut' when right-clicking and frankly this has really slowed me down; so far CMD+X as an alternative is not working for me so need to fix that.
Other bug-bears; renaming files can be frustratingly slow, and no support for batch renaming has also spurned commercial alternatives.
For me this basic functionality in 2010 should come way before a pretty GUI and beautiful design, and I have the feeling that I'll be paying out quite a lot of cash to get my MBP to where I was with Win XP functionality.
I'm sticking with the Mac and am slowly weaning myself off Parallels 5, but am frankly so far underwhelmed by my initial experience.
My overriding impression is that Macs are more suitable than windows based machines for those with limited technical knowledge, although from what I've read they are also highly customisable by more experienced users. Other negatives I've found;
- after only a week or so of owning my sexy MBP, installing a mobile broadband USB stick killed my system and I had to pay someone to get it back up and booting. As a newbie I didn't have the knowledge to fix the problem, but this should NOT EVER happen on any OS - and I never paid anyone a penny in 20 years of using Windows OS.
- the 1 year warranty is a big putoff and that needs to be changed sharpish to increase consumer confidence in the product and to reward the faithful.
- there is much less available freeware for Macs
- the virus thing is a non-argument and I never had a virus on Windows. Those who open every attachment they receive and download everything that shines deserve what they get. Keep boasting about how virus-free Macs are, and hackers will soon write something to piss on your bonfire.
I hope you read this Steve (my cup is half full) and take on board the comments. Meantime, I'm sticking with it and I have to say that your pad thing is simply EXCELLENT ... always plugged a mouse into machines before, but this is a joy to use - cheers.
p.s.
you need to spank someone in your organisation for not having sufficient magic mice available for Christmas. Despite your good recent results you lost a shedload of sales over here in Europe for that reason... and pissed a lot of people off.