Saudi Judge: Slapping a Spendthrift Wife is OK

1. Johnny Cat
   May 11th, 2009 at 1:53 pm

   In related news, the Saudi commerce department has issued a 180% increase in the price of abayas.

2. Vonskippy
   May 11th, 2009 at 1:54 pm

   Hello, the stone age called, they'd like their dumbass ideology back.

   Of course it's hard to tell who's more to blame - the self centered ego maniac men, or the doormat-esque women that put up with them?

3. What the Holy Heck
   May 11th, 2009 at 1:57 pm

   Ah, this would be that "we treat women with the respect and protection they deserve" thing Islamic men keep going on about. Got it. Thanks.

4. Gauldar
   May 11th, 2009 at 2:00 pm

   Brilliant... Does Sharia Law know no bounds? How bad does this have to get before it gets better?

5. Christophe
   May 11th, 2009 at 2:12 pm

   So you have branded abayas? Fashion is everywhere

6. Skipweasel
   May 11th, 2009 at 2:33 pm

   If I spent that much on an item of clothing my wife might not slap me, but she'd make sure I'd wish she had.

7. seefish3
   May 11th, 2009 at 3:01 pm

   Not to back him up, but you'll notice reading the article, that this is one man's opinion on this subject, not a tenet of Islamic law.

   Besides, this is just one of those "Don't forget we're all supposed to hate someone" articles designed to keep our blood pressure up.

8. TheDiversePurse
   May 11th, 2009 at 3:15 pm

   *Sigh* SMH

9. Alex
   May 11th, 2009 at 4:59 pm

   @seefish3: not just *anybody*. He's a judge.

10. seefish3
    May 11th, 2009 at 5:49 pm

    @alex

    You've also managed to imply in your headline that this is the same judge that ruled on underage marriage, when it isn't.

    And sure, we've got judges in this country against Roe vs. Wade. Have they overturned it? Will we let them?

11. Kalel
    May 11th, 2009 at 6:21 pm

    Abaya beware.

12. Alex
    May 11th, 2009 at 6:37 pm

    @seefish3 - indeed, I may have inadvertently implied that it's the same judge. Added an update to the post.

13. Ryann
    May 11th, 2009 at 6:48 pm

    I agree with seefish3.
    Now, I'm an Atheist American and a feminist. But, I am not ethnocentric, unlike this article and others like it that I have seen here.
    I don't think women should be beaten, or married against their will. But I do believe in cultural relativism; What is deviance in my culture is not universally deviant.

    These women are not "doormats", this is the culture into which they were socialized, it is what they know.
    Americans haven't much to stand on anyway. Women only got the right to vote in 1919, and we still do not receive equal wages for equal work.
    There are many ways in which Islam provides more to women than traditional Western christian society. Women in Islam have been traditionally allowed to own their own property, even in marriage they retain their rights to what was theirs before the marriage. According to Islam (but not all islamic countries) women can initiate a divorce from their husbands, and can stipulate certain conditions in a marriage contract.
    Until recently Women did not have these rights in the US. Islam has been providing such rights since its inception.

    The Islamic Arabic culture has a very different history than we do, we cannot presume to judge. Culture is not static. Values change over time. Right now the conservatives of the Arabic world are gaining control, and a lot of that is a reaction to US actions in the Islamic world.

    I wish women were considered equal to men around the world, but they aren't anywhere. Not in the US, not in Saudi Arabia.
    So how about at least a semblance of neutrality here?

14. seefish3
    May 11th, 2009 at 7:29 pm

    Right on, Ryann!

    A few centuries ago we were selling (marrying) off our youngest daughters for land and cattle. Or declaring them witches (I know I keep harping on that, but it's my home state.)

    What other views were expressed at this seminar, besides the usual hot-button rantings of dipsticks?

15. aimee
    May 11th, 2009 at 8:14 pm

    Ryann, people like you are the reason our country is in the shitter. Every human being can decipher between good and evil....Its wrong..there is such a thing between right and wrong..take your neutrality and shove it up your ass.

16. Johnny Cat
    May 11th, 2009 at 8:27 pm

    Agreed Ryann.

    I knew there was a reason I liked the Cultural Relevance semester in Ethics class.

17. Justin
    May 11th, 2009 at 8:30 pm

    "What other views were expressed at this seminar, besides the usual hot-button rantings of dipsticks?"

    I believe the next topic under discussion was about why Argentinians are so morally and socially corrupt!

18. Johnny Cat
    May 11th, 2009 at 8:35 pm

    *Relativism

19. DaveL
    May 11th, 2009 at 10:21 pm

    Yet another reason why religion and the state should not intertwine.

20. Grok
    May 12th, 2009 at 4:47 am

    I wouldn't dismiss the significance of the judge's ruling. Sharia law is not a monolithic book of rules and regulations that are codified and enforced like domestic law. It's a myriad collection of fatwas and opinions expressed by imams, sheiks, and yes, even judges, all of whom can have overlapping roles in the case of many Muslim countries. So while it can be said that this is just "some judge" who made this decree, it does carry considerably more influence than a local district court or provincial judge in western countries, as there is no rule of law to speak of. Within Sharia law, the opinion of a single perceived authority figure, especially from Saudia Arabia, propagates to other circles of influence, often without question.

    Also, I fail to see how people can mix in elements of both moral relativism and absolutism in one thought. By saying that one culture is no better than another, then that would imply that not only are all cultures are able to exist without external influence and/or criticism, but also that what is considered right in one culture can be carried over to others without question, as all cultures are equal. At the same time, the same person infers judgment on their own culture to be poor because it doesn't meet the expectations of an absolute standard of morality. This seems logically incongruous.

    In this case, by saying that this is acceptable in Saudi culture simply because it's their culture, what's the moral impedance for it to not be accepted in non-Muslim countries? By not criticizing it, we accept it, no? Also, we can't be respectful of a culture and yet still criticize? Honestly, I just viewed this piece as a "well, that's odd" article, but if it's going to be taken as "hot-button ranting", then the prophecy fulfills itself.

21. ted
    May 12th, 2009 at 7:10 am

    I just think Ryann can't help thinking that way. After all, she's only a product of her environment, and as such, can only have the limited viewpoint of that environment.

    It's only been 90 years since women got the vote, after all. That's not even a whole century, yet. Hardly enough time for anything significant to happen in the world.

    I didn't take this article as a "there they go again, those wacky Saudis", but merely as another example where women are treated like dirt in a culture that doesn't mind doing so.

22. Chandrielle
    May 12th, 2009 at 8:19 am

    When I moved to Texas, my husband told me there was a law saying that if the Cowboys lose, it was legal to beat your wife.

    He's my ex-husband now....

23. antemon
    May 12th, 2009 at 9:12 am

    just wanted to point out that the 8 yr old kid that was engaged is now free of it.

    someone turned over the ruling. read that on yahoo news or something.

24. Del Taco
    May 12th, 2009 at 12:05 pm

    "The Islamic Arabic culture has a very different history than we do, we cannot presume to judge."

    Right. So if they had slavery you wouldn't allow yourself to say that that was wrong cause that's there culture and it used to be legal in the US. Brilliant.

    I judge. Beating women is bad. People who justify it are schmucks.

25. vonskippy
    May 12th, 2009 at 7:35 pm

    Lucky for the rest of the world those wacky Muslim types aren't judgmental towards other cultures that don't indulge in their version of self delusion.

26. Enough is enough
    May 14th, 2009 at 8:48 am

    Backwards Country In Backwards Law Shocker!

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